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Iron Fist |
The Honorverse and David Weber |
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I was just wondering if anyone here has read any of David Weber's SF work, specifically the books that are part of his "Honorverse." They make a
great (and long) read and are definitely a Star Wars-esque type of story. If there is anyone else who reads this series and wants to discuss it, feel free to
do so here. And if you are interested in reading it, I can tell you what to look for and so on.
You know, its kind of sad that if I were to mention the discussions that go on here to somebody in the real world, they would call me crazy as well as
obsessive and a complete geek/nerd/whatever. Then I come here and discover that I'm way out of my league. Especially when people recall details that I
don't even remember....
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Kirr Mistwelder |
#1 | |||
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I read the first book, 'On Basilisk Station' and thought it was ok. I wasn't really digging the telepathic cat, and felt the whole 'jaded first
officer who felt he should have been promoted over this upstart young female captain so he's going to do everything in his power to undermine her but
ultimately he'll turn out to be ok and like her and get promoted to the position he felt he should have' was a tired old plot device. So, the first
book in the series did not do what it arguably is supposed to do - hook me in to read the next book.
I recently finished 'Lost Fleet: Dauntless' which is a book in the same vein (space ship navy engagements) and that book will be making my list of best books I've read this year and it hooked me into reading the next novel in the series as well. A little less 'fantastical' than telepathic cats, a little more realistic military sci-fi. The only other thing about the Honorverse is the amount of books in it - it just seems an insurmountable pile of novels to get caught up. I'd have to REALLY loved book 1 to want to continue with a series that's as long as this one is. However, I've been pleasantly surprised before - I didn't think much of the first books of Kevin Anderson's Saga of the Seven Suns or Sharon Shinn's Twelve Houses and wound up loving both series. So anything's possible. |
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Iron Fist |
#2 | |||
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The books do vary in quality unfortunately but I thought they were generally good. What was Lost Fleet about othern than naval engagements?
You know, its kind of sad that if I were to mention the discussions that go on here to somebody in the real world, they would call me crazy as well as
obsessive and a complete geek/nerd/whatever. Then I come here and discover that I'm way out of my league. Especially when people recall details that I
don't even remember....
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Kirr Mistwelder |
#3 | |||
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Take one part (the New) Battlestar Galactica and mix with Master & Commander and Enders Game and you get Lost Fleet. The opens with the fleet having been
defeated at the hands of their enemy in a war that has lasted 100 years. The higher ups in the chain of command go to negotiate terms - and are slaughtered.
Captain Black Jack Geary (who's only just been awoken from a near 100 year slumber in suspended animation) was asked to lead the fleet if negotiations went
south - and now he's trying to keep the fleet from tearing itself apart while he flees from their enemies as they try to make their way home. Black Jack
was at the opening battle of the war - thought to have defended his retreating men to his death - and he's been a hero and an idol to 100 years worth of
soldiers - something he doesn't feel he deserves nor can he possibly live up to. And now that he's alive again, many are finding he's not acting
the part they want him to - and yet he is likely their only hope for getting home and possibly even their last hope in defeating their enemy.
There are two more books already out in the series, and another one due in a couple of months. I think I saw on the author's website that its planned for 6 books. So tell me what you enjoy about the Honroverse books, and are there any in particular you'd recommend? Do you feel they have to be read in order, or do they stand alone well? |
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Iron Fist |
#4 | |||
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The early ones are decent stand alones but the farther you are, the more important it is that you understand the stories. The book list is:
1. On Basilisk Station 2. Honor of the Queen 3. The Short Victorious War 4. Field of Dishonor 5. Flag in Exile 6. Honor Amony Enemies 7. In Enemy Hands 8. Echoes of Honor 9. Ashes of Citory 10. War of Honor 11. At All Costs Spin-offs 1. Anthologies of short stories (by many authors) -More Than Honor -Worlds of Honor -Changer of Worlds -The Service of the Sword 2. Side series #1 -The Shadow of Saganami 3. Side series #2 -Crown of Slaves The main series has a lot of great space battles (the farther into the series, generally the more ships per battle). The short story anthologies are great if you are interested in the main series as it fills in the background as well as telling some hilarious and heart-breaking stories. And the side series are decent but only if you liked the main series. As for the main series, the later books begin dealing with a lot of political maneuvering/intrigue which is interesting if you can read through it but can kill you if you get stuck in it. The only other thing is that a lot of the books are fairly long so you have to be interested in them to read through it. I can usually read through one of the 800 page books within a week if I am really interested. I would suggest reading the next two books in the series (The Short Victorious War and Honor of the Queen) as both are fairly good and a good measuring stick for the series. it is too bad that you didn't like the treecat side story as that only gets more intense (and IMO, awesome). At one point, it does get a little strange but it is done in a way that makes it semi-believable. I'll create a mini-summary (without major spoilers) for Honor of the Queen so you can see if it interests you. By the way, who wrote Lost Fleet? Honor of the Queen: Honor is dispatched with a small task force (heavy cruiser, two light cruisers and a destroyer if memory serves) to the planet of Grayson as the tension between the Star Kingdom of Manticore and the People's Republic of Haven heats up. Both sides are looking for forward bases. Grayson and her sister planet, Masada are older planets originally settled by religious extremists. When they arrive on Grayson, however, they discover that the planet is toxic (lots of heavy metals) but they stick it out beliving that it is God's will. They also regress technologically. Eventually, the religious extremists (the Faithful) start a war which ends in their exile to Masada. The Faithful's goal is the extermination of the Graysons. Manticore comes to make a deal with Grayson and Haven is making a covert deal with Masada to destroy Grayson. Honor Harrington leads the taskforce while her mentor, Admiral Courovosier leads the diplomatic team. There is just one problem. The Grayson's (because of their planet and traditions) belive that women don't belong in uniform or in any "man's" job. They aren't sexists but it is their beliefs. Honor is forced to confront Grayson dissatisfaction with the women in Manticore as well as foil the Masadan plot. That's a little long but that should give you an idea. The book has some great space battles as well as philosphical ideas in it as well. Hope that helps. You know, its kind of sad that if I were to mention the discussions that go on here to somebody in the real world, they would call me crazy as well as
obsessive and a complete geek/nerd/whatever. Then I come here and discover that I'm way out of my league. Especially when people recall details that I
don't even remember....
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Kirr Mistwelder |
#5 | |||
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The Lost Fleet series is written by Jack Campbell. Dauntless is first. Fearless is second and Courageous is third, not that I've read either yet (I have
Fearless on reserve at the library). Valiant (book 4) is due June 2008. He also writes under the name John Hemry.
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Iron Fist |
#6 | |||
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Thanks. I'll be looking it up soon as I am looking for a new book to read.
You know, its kind of sad that if I were to mention the discussions that go on here to somebody in the real world, they would call me crazy as well as
obsessive and a complete geek/nerd/whatever. Then I come here and discover that I'm way out of my league. Especially when people recall details that I
don't even remember....
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skuldren |
#7 | |||
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All right, I took my plunge into the Honorverse, thanks to Iron Fist, and I must say I don't regret it. I started off reading On Basilisk
Station via the free online copy on the Baen Books site. I was immediately hooked and drawn in. I liked the way the author develops the characters and
the motivations of each. Plus the terminology of the series is interesting and I like reading about the various technologies they deal with. Most of my
enjoyment comes from just enjoying a new world of adventure and the military aspects of the series.
Well I liked what I read online so much, I decided I had to get the book (I much prefer books to ebooks). Having finished On Basilisk Station I wasn't disappointed. It was a good read and refreshing. Now I'm a quarter of the way into Honor of the Queen and pretty certain that this series will have me hooked to the end. I am a big reader so there's nothing better than finding a long enjoyable series to dive into. This one looks to be promising. |
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Iron Fist |
#8 | |||
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It is...it definitely is. Hope you enjoy so I can discuss it all with at least one person.
I especially liked Honor of the Queen as it just presents so many issues of today and completely makes fun of them, showing their outdated basis. Great book. I may have to start rereading the series again... You know, its kind of sad that if I were to mention the discussions that go on here to somebody in the real world, they would call me crazy as well as
obsessive and a complete geek/nerd/whatever. Then I come here and discover that I'm way out of my league. Especially when people recall details that I
don't even remember....
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skuldren |
#9 | |||
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Well I'm on Honor Among Enemies right now. The war between the Peeps and Manticore kind of reminds me of the East
Front in WWII. The German war machine is like Manticore, high quality tech in smaller numbers, while the Peeps are Russia, all mass and chaos rolling along and
getting more deadlier as it goes.
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Iron Fist |
#10 | |||
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Oh yes. And there's only one thing that's really letting Manticore stand right now but I can't quite tell you what it is.
Honor Among Enemies is pretty good. It's got a great sub-story involving one of the ensigns (I believe) whose name I cannot remember. And ensign and Stilgar? No, that's Dune. Stilson or something like that. Classic under-dog story.
You know, its kind of sad that if I were to mention the discussions that go on here to somebody in the real world, they would call me crazy as well as
obsessive and a complete geek/nerd/whatever. Then I come here and discover that I'm way out of my league. Especially when people recall details that I
don't even remember....
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skuldren |
#11 | |||
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Well I'm on In Enemy Hands now. I figured by the title that Honor was going to get captured, but when it happened it still hit me pretty good.
Though there are some things that bothered my about the event. 1.)They had Allistar's ship in the lead so it would be able to warn the others, and
supposedly it would even be able to escape. 2.)Honor went on to Allistar's ship during a mission for what she would know would be a prolonged period, and
didn't bring a skinsuit. 3.)She refused to leave the bridge even for a moment just to put on a rescue suit.
All right, here's why each one bothered me. First off if you have someone on point, I can see them getting jumped and the others getting warned, however it came very close to that warning not being possible. The problem is the Peeps saw where the point ship came out of hyper and could have sat there to catch the others. If there is no way to warn the others still in hyper fast enough for it to mean anything, what is the point of even having someone in the lead? It would have made more sense to split the forces arrival points or arrive as one, than to signal to the enemy where it is that the convoy is coming in at. Second, Honor should have known better. This is definitely a point where she actually screwed up. Blame is completely in her court for that one, and even though nothing bad came of it, she shouldn't let herself so easily off the hook. Thirdly, what was she thinking? How could she be so stubborn headed and foolish? It couldn't have taken that long to go change into a suit and return. I could see her wanting to be on the bridge, but putting her life at risk like that was very careless. Nevertheless, I'm really like the new Peep characters the author is introducing. Tourville is pretty cool. |
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Iron Fist |
#12 | |||
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That's definitely one of the things that starts happening around this point is that the series takes on what could almost be described as a second set of
protagonists. Thiesman, Giscard, Tourville, Caslet, Foraker, Jourdain, and Giscar'd commissioner who's name I cannot think of all start to take on a
better light.
As for your points: 1) I'd have to reread the book to be sure but your explanation sounds reasonable I guess. 2) I see what you're saying but I can see Honor not worrying about it and that sort of thing. 3) That's Honor. She's very, very stubborn so I could see her doing that sort of thing. For some reason, the next book, Echoes of Honor, never sits well with me when I think about it yet when I read it, I always love it. Not really sure why.... Oh, you're about to find out how awesome Harkness is. He is just amazing. You know, its kind of sad that if I were to mention the discussions that go on here to somebody in the real world, they would call me crazy as well as
obsessive and a complete geek/nerd/whatever. Then I come here and discover that I'm way out of my league. Especially when people recall details that I
don't even remember....
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skuldren |
#13 | |||
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Well I'm on Ashes of Victory now. Two things of interest: 1.) uniforms 2.) ships
First off the Peeps do wear green and gray uniforms. At first read, that doesn't seem so bad, but then I saw a picture of one and they look horrendous. Terrible fashion design. However the RMN's black and gold and the Grayson's blue on blue is much more reasonable. Another note would be State Sec is red and black. Go figure the SS always has the more stylish uniforms... And with the introduction of long range missile ships, and LAC carriers, the Honorverse is really heating up. Plus the books I'm reading now include nice little illustrations of the RMN's ships. I think they may have even included the Peeps, but I'm not sure. Regardless I love studying the various techs. Nothing better than delving into strategies for fictional universes, lol. |
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Iron Fist |
#14 | |||
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That is one of my favorite things about the serious is the way in which technology is represented. First, the introduction of anterigone (not sure if
that's the right word for this series. But it's the age lengthening thing) allows the books to "advance" at a much faster rate then you
realize. I believe the time from Basilisk station to War of Honor is some 20 years. And that, of course, means we get to see new technologies at a more
reasonable rate.
You know, its kind of sad that if I were to mention the discussions that go on here to somebody in the real world, they would call me crazy as well as
obsessive and a complete geek/nerd/whatever. Then I come here and discover that I'm way out of my league. Especially when people recall details that I
don't even remember....
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skuldren |
#15 | |||
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"Oops." -Shannon Foraker
I finished reading Ashes of Victory. It started out slow, in fact the first half of it seemed slow going. Yet it was also understandable because there was a lot that needed to be done. Honor was healing and training, the admirals were preparing their big offensives, and the politicians were scheming away with their massive power plays. However, all that slowness comes to a massive ludicrous speed launch at the end. There is so much change in this book that its hard to fathom. The two big superpowers are both decapitated, in fact the Peeps get their heads lopped off twice. Haven is finally set in White Haven's sights and BAM! They threw a peace treaty. I must say, it was great. And what better way to end it than with Shannon blowing up a bunch of SS ships to save Tourville and Theisman taking out Saint-Just. This was one of the best endings yet! |
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Iron Fist |
#16 | |||
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I have to agree. It's been a while since I've read AoV but I do rembmer and will never forget, Shannon's final line. It was just so perfect in
every way. A perfect summation of everything her character is. That being said, I absolutely loved the space battles of this book, especially the new technical
aspects. And the way a lot of older characters really shined (Tremaine, Harkness, etc).
You know, its kind of sad that if I were to mention the discussions that go on here to somebody in the real world, they would call me crazy as well as
obsessive and a complete geek/nerd/whatever. Then I come here and discover that I'm way out of my league. Especially when people recall details that I
don't even remember....
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skuldren |
#17 | |||
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Yes, but these details are fresh in my mind from just reading it. The true uber nerds have memory recall from decades ago.
This next book, War of Honor, is kind of interesting. Nearly three years have passed with so much change at the end of the last book, that you're forced to catch up again. The treecats can sign, the government has changed, and something ups with Silesia and the Aldermani. And then this new terminus. I think I see a conflict brewing. I wonder how long High Ridge is going to last. This new Manty government is bound to implode. Maybe a nice, wrathful Peep-like political explosion
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Iron Fist |
#18 | |||
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It is quite interesting although, once again, it's got a lot of politics in the beginning. This book also serves as a jump-off point for Shadows of
Saganami which deals with the new terminus in more depth. That being said, you're quickly coming to At All Costs which, in some ways, eclipses Ashes of
Victory, at least in terms of the ending.
Let me know how it's going. You know, its kind of sad that if I were to mention the discussions that go on here to somebody in the real world, they would call me crazy as well as
obsessive and a complete geek/nerd/whatever. Then I come here and discover that I'm way out of my league. Especially when people recall details that I
don't even remember....
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skuldren |
#19 | |||
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I'm liking the fact that the Peeps aren't out of it yet. Old Pierre and Saint-Just have some secret weapon in their secret starship yard and now
Shannon is in charge of it. *sighs in glee* But there is a lot of politiking going on with both the Peeps and the Manties. It's interesting that with the
Peep's new government, I seriously like them better now than Manticore. I mean they've got Eloise in charge with Theisman as the head of the war
department and Giscard and Tourville with their own fleets. Since White Haven has been retired, I'm tempted to think the Peeps have a more solid military
leadership, at least at the upper levels right now. High Ridge doesn't stand a chance.
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Iron Fist |
#20 | |||
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That's one thing that happens is that we now have two groups of protagonists arrayed against each other. Makes for an interesting book at least. That
being said, I do like how the Peeps are based on the United States. You know, its kind of sad that if I were to mention the discussions that go on here to somebody in the real world, they would call me crazy as well as
obsessive and a complete geek/nerd/whatever. Then I come here and discover that I'm way out of my league. Especially when people recall details that I
don't even remember....
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