How will NGPW work?

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Acky12	How will NGPW work?		Lead	[-]
Posts: 12375 09/01/03 8:20 AM I’m responsible for all this...	Tags : None I figured it'd be better to just go ahead and explain what I think EDD was alluding to in his post the other day and I had intended to sort that out with him because I didn't have a chance to explain, I just basically had enough time to start the explanation but had to duck out and he was gone when I got back. There will be many differences with NGPW, time, story, setup, situation of the galaxy on multiple levels, etc, but the biggest difference is how Aaron is involved. Aaron will be acting as "story collaborator" to make sure that someone doesn't shoot off too much to where we have 15 bajilion sub-plots going on, making sure someone doesn't try to run away with the plot, and just keeping everything in check. He has mod powers of the forum and it is suggested that everyone talks to him via ezInbox or AIM or MSN and run your plot ideas by him. Aaron isn't there to try and contain people, only to make sure that everyone has a fair say. His goal is ONLY to make sure that we never loose sight of the main plot. Now don't take that as saying that the plot is mapped out - only the beginning is, the setup which will take some time to get moving (as we decided not to jump right into the arc with the opener but rather setup the scene, let you guys establish some characters, and then begin the action). Aside from the beginning anything can happen and the story can go anywhere imaginable. With a few reservations. Aaron is basically going to do what I had tried to do with the other stories to keep people in check. You know - keep people (mostly new people) from god-modding, from bringing in Star Trek (hem Who could that be?) or other plots, brining back characters or heavy references to the previous PW, and more importantly make sure that even accidently, things aren't touched that have been requested not to be touched (specifically at this point the Hands and there's another thing I'm holding up my sleeve that should make sense once we start). Does that help? Comments? Complaints?
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Ed2D2	Re: How will NGPW work?	#1	[url]	[-]
Posts: 551 09/01/03 1:27 PM	I do have major concerns about this; NJOE is not the authority over PW, and you are not the moderator of PW. You are simply the host, who was extremely kind and generous enough to let the community use your forum. Every participant in PW has an equal say in how it is run, so any changes to how we do things need to be thoroughly debated and voted on. Some further thoughts on the "story collaborator" position: *Quote:* Aaron is basically going to do what I had tried to do with the other stories to keep people in check. This could set a precedent of PW not being as spontaneous... PW is very distinct from other story projects, because there is no central authority that governs PW. *Quote:* You know - keep people (mostly new people) from god-modding, Who decides what god-modding is? If something is blatantly impeding the story, do we really need a leader to keep things on track? Just depending on the social structures of the PW community seems to have worked fine so far. *Quote:* from bringing in Star Trek (hem Who could that be?) or other plots, Theres nothing wrong about bringing in other plots at all. While by nature it is intensely original, PW shouldnt have a rule barring the entrance of other plots. The use of Star Trek wasnt bad, it was just overdone, and our discussions with you about that were enough to solve the problems that popped up as a result. In fact, PW has a grand tradition of copying characters or ideas from other sources but then spicing it up a little... The Yuuzhan Veggies, Boris and Natasha, life here on Earth, history... There should be no official restrictions (except, of course, to follow copyright law) because the community has always been effective at self-policing. *Quote:* brining back characters or heavy references to the previous PW, And whats wrong with that? This is, afterall, PW. If anything, references would be fun... a wink and a nudge, a nod in awknowledgement to those of us who have been around for a while, if you will. *Quote:* and more importantly make sure that even accidently, things aren't touched that have been requested not to be touched (specifically at this point the Hands and there's another thing I'm holding up my sleeve that should make sense once we start). We dont need a central authority to govern this, as it has never been a problem. We have always had the basic social rule never to kill another persons charcters without permission and to respect requests not to touch. I guess my concern is that the story could lose its freedom. The charm of PW has always come from the fact that were just a small group of friends and fans who come together to have fun writing something and watching a saga, an artistic expression, unfold. We dont need editors, leaders, or collaborators; the PW should always be purely democratic. This means, of course, that if the majority of the people here want the collaborator, we will have one as it is the will of the entire community. The way this is being organized seems a little close to the class system weve been trying to eliminate the whole while. What do you think?
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Acky12	Re: How will NGPW work?	#2	[url]	[-]
Posts: 12375 09/01/03 4:22 PM I’m responsible for all this...	You know, for someone too busy to be involved you certainly seem opiniontated. I do'nt think it's reverting to a class system at all, and while spontinuity is great, if a plot is started it can't just be ignored - that's the main purpose, that we don't loose track of where we were as we write. Aaron's not going to say "OK, your plot is crap, but go ahead and do it because I like you" or "Come up with something new because I don't like you'. Do you remember PW3? How really there was just a subplot from every person and no real interaction - thus why we did what we did in PW4? THAT is what Aaron is going to try to do -- people come up with their sub-story lines and he comes up with a way to tie it all together into the main plot. Perhaps Aaron'll get on and he can explain this a bit better than I can.
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Acky12	Re: How will NGPW work?	#3	[url]	[-]
Posts: 12375 09/01/03 6:22 PM I’m responsible for all this...	Ok, I've thought about this more. I understand your points and they make perfect sense, but I think in the long run, Aaron's position will be more beneficial to the stories. And I think part of the confusion is that I have yet to come up with a good description / title for Aaron's position. So I came up with a good analogy. Aaron will be acting in a similar manor to how I act on CG in regards to you (EDD) and Lights as you guys write your sub-plots. I've set you guys up with a story to introduce your own characters and situations and say "go to it." And you guys go, with certain limitations (IE: Your people can't suddenly rally a huge army and take out Earth and similarily Lights' can't suddenly jump and destroy Earth). And only when there's a question do I hear from you guys on your plot -- similar to what happened yesterday. Lights presented me with an arc of how his stuff would work and I read over it and said Great, write it; I've got 1 complaint. And so I proceeded to first answer his question about what systems would be good to attack while keeping the interest of the plot in hand and I said no, take it out, on one part because also in interest of the plot setup that character can't know the information Lights wanted him to have. Does that help? Let's look at PW1 and PW2. Why were they so sucessful? Well for one sense they were early and still maturing and we were at a point one person would come in and say "hey, here's the problem. let's get out of it." But I think the bigger reason that they succedded was because the mission WAS so clear-cut and everyone had to work together to solve the problem. The most prominent of these being the Second Veggie War which carried over into PW2. PW2's been called the best of all 5 - why? Again, I think because we were forced to work together to defeat the Veggies or die at their hand. But PW3 changed that: there wasn't a clear-cut enemy, it was time to explore freely but there wasn't anything to hold us together. It was a bunch of sub-plots with everyone creating their own enemy to fight, their own plot. We attempted to rectify this in PW4 by pushing everyone on the same planet with the same enemy, but there was something missing. And we all know where PW5 went. All we're trying to do with Aaron in NGPW is setup the plot, let people establish their characters, and start it in motion. There is no ending: all that's planned is what would be handled in the first few opening posts. Aaron is only in existance to make sure that the sub-plots remained in check and to try and keep everyone focused.
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CommishAaron	Re: How will NGPW work?	#4	[url]	[-]
Posts: 52 09/01/03 8:36 PM	Well, that's not entirely true, Acky; I've got some ideas in mind for the ending (vague ideas, nothing specific, and all related to the brainwashing segment...I've got nothing as far as the aliens go). EDD, read my post in the other thread. I explain myself a little more clearer in there. I do understand your points, and I'm not going to try and impede the creative process. I just want to coordinate things better, b/c PW3, 4, and 5 didn't work b/c nobody was willing to work together and coordinate with each other. It will be less spontaneous and more restricting, but I think we're at the point where spontanuity will not work. BTW Acky, I'd just like to point out that we don't all know how 5 turned out; I don't remember a damn thing from it. 3-5 were complete failures; I think its time we recognize this and realize that throwing good money after bad isn't going to fix the problems inherint to 3-5. Some problems (off the top of my head): lack of coordination, no clear focus, no establishment of characters before having them used in major plot points (iow, someone will post a story w/ 10 new characters all doing something apparently important w/o giving others the opportunity to figure out who they all are), long character names that all look the same (I'm partly guilty of that, Tal I'm mainly talking to you...this combines w/ the too many characters w/o build up as well), lack of direction, lack of original ideas, lack of time to write for many authors, overdependence on one or two ppl, direct implentation of every sci fi story imaginable, too many doomsday weapons, too broad an area, too many plots, etc, etc, etc. These aren't problems that will go away by themselves; PW3-5 showed a complete INABILITY for us to police ourselves. And I believe w/o someone to curb some of the excesses and keep us on the right track, NGPW will go down in flames like the last 3.
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Ed2D2	Re: How will NGPW work?	#5	[url]	[-]
Posts: 551 09/01/03 8:48 PM	I'll be the first to admit I'm overly opinionated at times... I apologize if I come off as angry or rude. That is certainly not the intention; I'm happy as long as everybody else is happy here, I'm just trying to bring up some principles I find important. And I am seriously rethinking not returning (I cant leave something like the PW... Its so much fun. Still thinking about it, though) Some thoughts: I disagree on why PW3+5 failed... Everyone had a seperate plot line because nobody would let one another touch each other's plot lines. And when someone tried to make them interact, the other person would grow angry. And the system would bring back the class system only because the way you guys approached this shows that the class system still exists. Nobody is supposed to be in charge of the PW, yet it was two or three of us that chose the new plot line, and it was Acky who appointed Aaron to be the story coordinator. The way I see it, Acky, while you are an important contributor and it is great that you agreed to host the story, you did not have the authority to do this. You write *Quote:* Aaron will be acting in a similar manor to how I act on CG in regards to you (EDD) and Lights as you guys write your sub-plots. This makes it sound like the PW is like CG, that its a project for someone to claim control of. If everybody agrees that we need a story coordinator, then that is that. The PW is democratic, and I will cooperatively work within that system. But this is the whole trouble with the way youre going about this, Ackster. You didnt make a proposal that we have a story coordinator, and you didnt make a suggestion what the plot was going to be. You announced that you had a plot all ready and you made a decree that Aaron would be story coordinator. You dont have that authority; the power in PW belongs to anyone. All of these issues should be debated and discussed thoroughly, then put to a vote, not decided by two or three of the upper class (no offense intended... I admit that I had as much to do with maintaining the class system as anyone else). I suppose those are my main concerns. One part of what concerns me is how effectively the new structure will work, but the larger issue is that this should be a democratic process.
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Acky12	Re: How will NGPW work?	#6	[url]	[-]
Posts: 12375 09/01/03 8:52 PM I’m responsible for all this...	*Quote:* This makes it sound like the PW is like CG, that its a project for someone to claim control of. No, not at all -- but that was just the best example I could coem up with.
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